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As this technology begins to be deployed is anyone out there planning ahead for wave two of this?  I know it’s not going to happen for a while but I’m curious if there are folks in the process of new construction where you have the option to add the infrastructure now to support the 10Gbps.  If so, has there been any documentation on what cable type would be recommended for this? (ex. CAT6A or CAT7).

 

Thanks,

 

 

Joe Stewart

Network Specialist I

Information Systems and Network Services

Claremont McKenna College

325 E. 8th Street, Roberts South #12

Claremont, CA 91711

 

********** Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/.

Comments

HI Joe,

 

We are moving ahead with and future WAP installs using 2 x CAT6A per the upcoming/pending TIA TSB-162-A recommendations & approval:

 

See:

http://www.cablinginstall.com/articles/print/volume-21/issue-8/features/tia-revising-specification-for-cabling-wireless-access-points.html

 

Also see:

http://www.ieee802.org/3/bq/public/nov13/larsen_3bq_01_1113.pdf

 

 

Chad

 

Chad D Burnham

Director of Telecommunications

University Technology Services

University of Denver

2100 S. High St. #106

Denver, CO 80208

Desk Phone: 303-871-4441

Mobile Phone: 303-520-5657

 

 

 

 

Call me naïve, but I think 10 gig uplinks for ac WAPs is serious overkill.  We have almost 4,500 switches across campus, most with 1 gig user uplinks, and the vast majority are perfectly fine with 1G (heck, we could swap a good number of those for 100 Meg, and they’d barely notice).  These are switches with 48+ connected devices, all at 1 gig.  So, for most access points that will be seeing far less users than a traditional edge switch with a one gig uplink, I don’t see the need to go crazy with the feed speed.  I could see deploying 2 single gig links to the .ac access points, but not 10 gig.  Exceptions to this ‘could’ be very dense classroom environments with a lot of access points (there are exceptions to everything).

 

Ryan H Turner

Senior Network Engineer

The University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill

CB 1150 Chapel Hill, NC 27599

+1 919 445 0113 Office

+1 919 274 7926 Mobile

 

We’ve decided for now to run two Cat6A to every AP for new construction. This is because right now it is not clear if vendors are going to utilize two Gig or one 10 Gig connection for each AP to support the theoretical oversubscription of one Gig by Wave2 and beyond. One of the challenges is that cabling lifecycle is 15-20 years easily which means that there will be multiple generations of wireless running on that cable beyond even wave2. For insurance in the long term, it seems to make the most sense to invest in 6A.

 

We are finding that CAT6A is very expensive to install due to the higher costs for the cable and termination hardware as well as labor. In addition, the pathway requirements for the fatter cable are also much more expensive and also disruptive if it is renovation of existing construction. Not sure what CAT7 will buy you. I believe it is shielded and will mix more easily with Cat6, and is more narrow which addresses pathway concerns, but there is also the hassle of terminating on a good ground which complicates things quite a bit.

 

Pete Morrissey

 

BTW…  Before anyone jumps on me, I understand the purpose of the question.  It’s great to know the best practices for the ‘what if’ situation. 

 

Ryan H Turner

Senior Network Engineer

The University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill

CB 1150 Chapel Hill, NC 27599

+1 919 445 0113 Office

+1 919 274 7926 Mobile

 

The WLAN industry is doing an absolutely horrible, almost shameful job of managing the message on cabling for 11ac, says I.

Lee Badman
Network Architect/Wireless TME
ITS, Syracuse University
315.443.3003

I swear, just a couple months ago I saw a post on this listserve that you should run TWO Cat6 runs for every 802.11ac AP.  Now, CAT6A?!

Larry Dougher
Chief Information Officer
Information Technology Services
Windsor Southeast Supervisory Union
127 State Street, Windsor, VT 05089
Email | Google+Twitter | LinkedIn | (802) 674-8336



Message from iam@st-andrews.ac.uk

We've fitted dual points at most of our more recent (read n) installations, where we could do so without causing other issues (read listed buildings). They're mostly cat6 rather than 6A, but all our refurbs / new build are 6A, and have been for about 3 years now.

Thanks

--
ian

Sent from my phone, please excuse brevity and misspelling.
From: Lee H Badman
Sent: ‎18/‎12/‎2013 17:57
To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] 802.11AC Future Infrastructure

The WLAN industry is doing an absolutely horrible, almost shameful job of managing the message on cabling for 11ac, says I.

Lee Badman
Network Architect/Wireless TME
ITS, Syracuse University
315.443.3003

Message from iam@st-andrews.ac.uk

6A isn't particularly more expensive in a new build / whole area refurbishment, and I figure the 'fit the best you can afford' route works for the best chance of it still being adequate in 20 years time.

My predecessor who shared this view did us a huge favour by insisting on Cat 5 when Cat 3 was prevalent, and indeed much of our Cat5 actually passes a 5e test, because it was of decent quality at the outset.

Thanks

--
ian

Sent from my phone, please excuse brevity and misspelling.
From: Larry Dougher
Sent: ‎18/‎12/‎2013 18:04
To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] 802.11AC Future Infrastructure

I swear, just a couple months ago I saw a post on this listserve that you should run TWO Cat6 runs for every 802.11ac AP.  Now, CAT6A?!

Larry Dougher
Chief Information Officer
Information Technology Services
Windsor Southeast Supervisory Union
127 State Street, Windsor, VT 05089
Email | Google+Twitter | LinkedIn | (802) 674-8336



Thanks everyone for the ideas/posts concerning this.  It seems crazy to me as well, but it doesn’t hurt to be prepared when preparing for future construction projects.  Heck we haven’t even deployed any first wave 802.11AC yet but will be shortly.

 

Thanks,

 

Joe

 

From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv [mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Ian McDonald
Sent: Wednesday, December 18, 2013 10:42 AM
To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] 802.11AC Future Infrastructure

 

6A isn't particularly more expensive in a new build / whole area refurbishment, and I figure the 'fit the best you can afford' route works for the best chance of it still being adequate in 20 years time.

My predecessor who shared this view did us a huge favour by insisting on Cat 5 when Cat 3 was prevalent, and indeed much of our Cat5 actually passes a 5e test, because it was of decent quality at the outset.

Thanks

--
ian

Sent from my phone, please excuse brevity and misspelling.

From: Larry Dougher
Sent: ‎18/‎12/‎2013 18:04
To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] 802.11AC Future Infrastructure

I swear, just a couple months ago I saw a post on this listserve that you should run TWO Cat6 runs for every 802.11ac AP.  Now, CAT6A?!


Larry Dougher
Chief Information Officer
Information Technology Services
Windsor Southeast Supervisory Union
127 State Street, Windsor, VT 05089
Email | Google+Twitter | LinkedIn | (802) 674-8336

 

And the WLAN industry also does strange math ;-)

A lot of services are going to the Cloud, mostly using your pipe to the Internet.
It seems that, progressively or even rapidly, the limiting factor is not Wi-Fi anymore but rather the pipe to the internet.
1 Gbps to each Wireless AP is a lot of bandwidth! and a lot of oversubscription all around (edge, distribution, core, WAN) 
Unless you plan to distribute UHDTV (8K TV) to your dorms, I wouldn't worry about getting more than 1 Gbps to each AP for a long time.
Also most of 802.11ac APs are fine with 802.3af!


Philippe Hanset

Message from iam@st-andrews.ac.uk

They certainly are using some strange math, my experience (and that of other institutions nearby) is that the vast majority of my N access points don't suffer from being connected to 100M poe switches, and in the places we have 1G to them, they generally don't use more than 100M.

Thanks

--
ian

Sent from my phone, please excuse brevity and misspelling.
From: Hanset, Philippe C
Sent: ‎18/‎12/‎2013 19:33
To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] 802.11AC Future Infrastructure

And the WLAN industry also does strange math ;-)

A lot of services are going to the Cloud, mostly using your pipe to the Internet.
It seems that, progressively or even rapidly, the limiting factor is not Wi-Fi anymore but rather the pipe to the internet.
1 Gbps to each Wireless AP is a lot of bandwidth! and a lot of oversubscription all around (edge, distribution, core, WAN) 
Unless you plan to distribute UHDTV (8K TV) to your dorms, I wouldn't worry about getting more than 1 Gbps to each AP for a long time.
Also most of 802.11ac APs are fine with 802.3af!


Philippe Hanset

Is much marketing foo-foo, in my opinion. The wired-side truth of the Wi-Fi story deflates a lot of the numbers that are meant to dazzle…

 

From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv [mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Ian McDonald
Sent: Wednesday, December 18, 2013 2:39 PM
To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] 802.11AC Future Infrastructure

 

They certainly are using some strange math, my experience (and that of other institutions nearby) is that the vast majority of my N access points don't suffer from being connected to 100M poe switches, and in the places we have 1G to them, they generally don't use more than 100M.

Thanks

--
ian

Sent from my phone, please excuse brevity and misspelling.

From: Hanset, Philippe C
Sent: ‎18/‎12/‎2013 19:33
To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] 802.11AC Future Infrastructure

And the WLAN industry also does strange math ;-)

 

A lot of services are going to the Cloud, mostly using your pipe to the Internet.

It seems that, progressively or even rapidly, the limiting factor is not Wi-Fi anymore but rather the pipe to the internet.

1 Gbps to each Wireless AP is a lot of bandwidth! and a lot of oversubscription all around (edge, distribution, core, WAN) 

Unless you plan to distribute UHDTV (8K TV) to your dorms, I wouldn't worry about getting more than 1 Gbps to each AP for a long time.

Also most of 802.11ac APs are fine with 802.3af!

 

 

Philippe Hanset

 

I would say take a close look at the 100M ports connected to your N or AC APs and check for output drops.  We've seen this in some locations where we we're careful about refreshing with N AP's.  It likely comes at peak times so if you're just graphing the in/out you will miss it.

Don Wright
Brown University



What is it you think is happening during output drops? -- Daniel Eklund Network Planning Manager ITS Communications Systems and Data Centers University of Michigan 734.763.6389
The packets being dropped on the way back to the AP because they're overrunning the 100M interface during peak wireless usage.   You'll also notice if you do a speedtest that the download is much worse than the upload.  We seen this disappear when we swap in a gig switch. 
- Don


There is also the option, if you're a vendor that owns both ends (AP and Switch) to do something creative with only a single Cat5/6.
 
Jeff

>>> On Wednesday, December 18, 2013 at 9:51 AM, in message <47FE4CC0B92ADA478ECC286A11E9730150AE6E@SUEX10-mbx-03.ad.syr.edu>, Peter P Morrissey <ppmorris@SYR.EDU> wrote:

We’ve decided for now to run two Cat6A to every AP for new construction. This is because right now it is not clear if vendors are going to utilize two Gig or one 10 Gig connection for each AP to support the theoretical oversubscription of one Gig by Wave2 and beyond. One of the challenges is that cabling lifecycle is 15-20 years easily which means that there will be multiple generations of wireless running on that cable beyond even wave2. For insurance in the long term, it seems to make the most sense to invest in 6A.

 

We are finding that CAT6A is very expensive to install due to the higher costs for the cable and termination hardware as well as labor. In addition, the pathway requirements for the fatter cable are also much more expensive and also disruptive if it is renovation of existing construction. Not sure what CAT7 will buy you. I believe it is shielded and will mix more easily with Cat6, and is more narrow which addresses pathway concerns, but there is also the hassle of terminating on a good ground which complicates things quite a bit.

 

Pete Morrissey

 

Years ago I “got creative” and made some patch cables that allowed me to put two 10M hosts on a single jack instead of pulling new cables.  The boss said unkind things and shoved a notebook of the TIA-568 spec in my face.  Ah, the bad old days…;-)

John

 

That was a "standard" across the AMP jacks...  you could get one Cat5 100Mbps, or two 10Mb "split cable" jacks.  It was a matter of which "insert" you plugged into the socket.

It wasn't my decision, and I cringe everytime I see one, but they're still around in our older campus buildings.

Jeff

On 12/18/2013 4:42 PM, John York wrote:

Years ago I “got creative” and made some patch cables that allowed me to put two 10M hosts on a single jack instead of pulling new cables.  The boss said unkind things and shoved a notebook of the TIA-568 spec in my face.  Ah, the bad old days…;-)

John

 

We had thousands of those, wired for usoc on the wallplate side, a splitter to send 2 pairs to two station cables with usoc on one and 568b on the station end. We had this for our entire cat-3 plant, and some of the early cat-5 (non-e) terminated on 110 blocks. I don't miss that any more than I miss faculty putting 10base2 on rg-59. Dale Thus spake John York (YorkJ@BRCC.EDU) on Wed, Dec 18, 2013 at 09:42:27PM +0000: > Years ago I “got creative” and made some patch cables that allowed me to put two 10M hosts on a single jack instead of pulling new cables. The boss said unkind things and shoved a notebook of the TIA-568 spec in my face. Ah, the bad old days…;-) > John > >
+1

This has been the case for us for years. 95%+ of our traffic is not local.

           
Rand
 
Rand P. Hall
Director, Network Services                 askIT!
Merrimack College
978-837-3532

If I had an hour to save the world, I would spend 59 minutes defining the problem and one minute finding solutions. – Einstein


As this technology begins to be deployed is anyone out there planning ahead for wave two of this?  I know it’s not going to happen for a while but I’m curious if there are folks in the process of new construction where you have the option to add the infrastructure now to support the 10Gbps.  If so, has there been any documentation on what cable type would be recommended for this? (ex. CAT6A or CAT7).

 

Thanks,

 

 

Joe Stewart

Network Specialist I

Information Systems and Network Services

Claremont McKenna College

325 E. 8th Street, Roberts South #12

Claremont, CA 91711

 

********** Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/.

HI Joe,

 

We are moving ahead with and future WAP installs using 2 x CAT6A per the upcoming/pending TIA TSB-162-A recommendations & approval:

 

See:

http://www.cablinginstall.com/articles/print/volume-21/issue-8/features/tia-revising-specification-for-cabling-wireless-access-points.html

 

Also see:

http://www.ieee802.org/3/bq/public/nov13/larsen_3bq_01_1113.pdf

 

 

Chad

 

Chad D Burnham

Director of Telecommunications

University Technology Services

University of Denver

2100 S. High St. #106

Denver, CO 80208

Desk Phone: 303-871-4441

Mobile Phone: 303-520-5657

 

 

 

 

Call me naïve, but I think 10 gig uplinks for ac WAPs is serious overkill.  We have almost 4,500 switches across campus, most with 1 gig user uplinks, and the vast majority are perfectly fine with 1G (heck, we could swap a good number of those for 100 Meg, and they’d barely notice).  These are switches with 48+ connected devices, all at 1 gig.  So, for most access points that will be seeing far less users than a traditional edge switch with a one gig uplink, I don’t see the need to go crazy with the feed speed.  I could see deploying 2 single gig links to the .ac access points, but not 10 gig.  Exceptions to this ‘could’ be very dense classroom environments with a lot of access points (there are exceptions to everything).

 

Ryan H Turner

Senior Network Engineer

The University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill

CB 1150 Chapel Hill, NC 27599

+1 919 445 0113 Office

+1 919 274 7926 Mobile

 

We’ve decided for now to run two Cat6A to every AP for new construction. This is because right now it is not clear if vendors are going to utilize two Gig or one 10 Gig connection for each AP to support the theoretical oversubscription of one Gig by Wave2 and beyond. One of the challenges is that cabling lifecycle is 15-20 years easily which means that there will be multiple generations of wireless running on that cable beyond even wave2. For insurance in the long term, it seems to make the most sense to invest in 6A.

 

We are finding that CAT6A is very expensive to install due to the higher costs for the cable and termination hardware as well as labor. In addition, the pathway requirements for the fatter cable are also much more expensive and also disruptive if it is renovation of existing construction. Not sure what CAT7 will buy you. I believe it is shielded and will mix more easily with Cat6, and is more narrow which addresses pathway concerns, but there is also the hassle of terminating on a good ground which complicates things quite a bit.

 

Pete Morrissey

 

BTW…  Before anyone jumps on me, I understand the purpose of the question.  It’s great to know the best practices for the ‘what if’ situation. 

 

Ryan H Turner

Senior Network Engineer

The University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill

CB 1150 Chapel Hill, NC 27599

+1 919 445 0113 Office

+1 919 274 7926 Mobile

 

The WLAN industry is doing an absolutely horrible, almost shameful job of managing the message on cabling for 11ac, says I.

Lee Badman
Network Architect/Wireless TME
ITS, Syracuse University
315.443.3003

I swear, just a couple months ago I saw a post on this listserve that you should run TWO Cat6 runs for every 802.11ac AP.  Now, CAT6A?!

Larry Dougher
Chief Information Officer
Information Technology Services
Windsor Southeast Supervisory Union
127 State Street, Windsor, VT 05089
Email | Google+Twitter | LinkedIn | (802) 674-8336



Message from iam@st-andrews.ac.uk

We've fitted dual points at most of our more recent (read n) installations, where we could do so without causing other issues (read listed buildings). They're mostly cat6 rather than 6A, but all our refurbs / new build are 6A, and have been for about 3 years now.

Thanks

--
ian

Sent from my phone, please excuse brevity and misspelling.
From: Lee H Badman
Sent: ‎18/‎12/‎2013 17:57
To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] 802.11AC Future Infrastructure

The WLAN industry is doing an absolutely horrible, almost shameful job of managing the message on cabling for 11ac, says I.

Lee Badman
Network Architect/Wireless TME
ITS, Syracuse University
315.443.3003

Message from iam@st-andrews.ac.uk

6A isn't particularly more expensive in a new build / whole area refurbishment, and I figure the 'fit the best you can afford' route works for the best chance of it still being adequate in 20 years time.

My predecessor who shared this view did us a huge favour by insisting on Cat 5 when Cat 3 was prevalent, and indeed much of our Cat5 actually passes a 5e test, because it was of decent quality at the outset.

Thanks

--
ian

Sent from my phone, please excuse brevity and misspelling.
From: Larry Dougher
Sent: ‎18/‎12/‎2013 18:04
To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] 802.11AC Future Infrastructure

I swear, just a couple months ago I saw a post on this listserve that you should run TWO Cat6 runs for every 802.11ac AP.  Now, CAT6A?!

Larry Dougher
Chief Information Officer
Information Technology Services
Windsor Southeast Supervisory Union
127 State Street, Windsor, VT 05089
Email | Google+Twitter | LinkedIn | (802) 674-8336



Thanks everyone for the ideas/posts concerning this.  It seems crazy to me as well, but it doesn’t hurt to be prepared when preparing for future construction projects.  Heck we haven’t even deployed any first wave 802.11AC yet but will be shortly.

 

Thanks,

 

Joe

 

From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv [mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Ian McDonald
Sent: Wednesday, December 18, 2013 10:42 AM
To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] 802.11AC Future Infrastructure

 

6A isn't particularly more expensive in a new build / whole area refurbishment, and I figure the 'fit the best you can afford' route works for the best chance of it still being adequate in 20 years time.

My predecessor who shared this view did us a huge favour by insisting on Cat 5 when Cat 3 was prevalent, and indeed much of our Cat5 actually passes a 5e test, because it was of decent quality at the outset.

Thanks

--
ian

Sent from my phone, please excuse brevity and misspelling.

From: Larry Dougher
Sent: ‎18/‎12/‎2013 18:04
To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] 802.11AC Future Infrastructure

I swear, just a couple months ago I saw a post on this listserve that you should run TWO Cat6 runs for every 802.11ac AP.  Now, CAT6A?!


Larry Dougher
Chief Information Officer
Information Technology Services
Windsor Southeast Supervisory Union
127 State Street, Windsor, VT 05089
Email | Google+Twitter | LinkedIn | (802) 674-8336

 

And the WLAN industry also does strange math ;-)

A lot of services are going to the Cloud, mostly using your pipe to the Internet.
It seems that, progressively or even rapidly, the limiting factor is not Wi-Fi anymore but rather the pipe to the internet.
1 Gbps to each Wireless AP is a lot of bandwidth! and a lot of oversubscription all around (edge, distribution, core, WAN) 
Unless you plan to distribute UHDTV (8K TV) to your dorms, I wouldn't worry about getting more than 1 Gbps to each AP for a long time.
Also most of 802.11ac APs are fine with 802.3af!


Philippe Hanset

Message from iam@st-andrews.ac.uk

They certainly are using some strange math, my experience (and that of other institutions nearby) is that the vast majority of my N access points don't suffer from being connected to 100M poe switches, and in the places we have 1G to them, they generally don't use more than 100M.

Thanks

--
ian

Sent from my phone, please excuse brevity and misspelling.
From: Hanset, Philippe C
Sent: ‎18/‎12/‎2013 19:33
To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] 802.11AC Future Infrastructure

And the WLAN industry also does strange math ;-)

A lot of services are going to the Cloud, mostly using your pipe to the Internet.
It seems that, progressively or even rapidly, the limiting factor is not Wi-Fi anymore but rather the pipe to the internet.
1 Gbps to each Wireless AP is a lot of bandwidth! and a lot of oversubscription all around (edge, distribution, core, WAN) 
Unless you plan to distribute UHDTV (8K TV) to your dorms, I wouldn't worry about getting more than 1 Gbps to each AP for a long time.
Also most of 802.11ac APs are fine with 802.3af!


Philippe Hanset

Is much marketing foo-foo, in my opinion. The wired-side truth of the Wi-Fi story deflates a lot of the numbers that are meant to dazzle…

 

From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv [mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Ian McDonald
Sent: Wednesday, December 18, 2013 2:39 PM
To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] 802.11AC Future Infrastructure

 

They certainly are using some strange math, my experience (and that of other institutions nearby) is that the vast majority of my N access points don't suffer from being connected to 100M poe switches, and in the places we have 1G to them, they generally don't use more than 100M.

Thanks

--
ian

Sent from my phone, please excuse brevity and misspelling.

From: Hanset, Philippe C
Sent: ‎18/‎12/‎2013 19:33
To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] 802.11AC Future Infrastructure

And the WLAN industry also does strange math ;-)

 

A lot of services are going to the Cloud, mostly using your pipe to the Internet.

It seems that, progressively or even rapidly, the limiting factor is not Wi-Fi anymore but rather the pipe to the internet.

1 Gbps to each Wireless AP is a lot of bandwidth! and a lot of oversubscription all around (edge, distribution, core, WAN) 

Unless you plan to distribute UHDTV (8K TV) to your dorms, I wouldn't worry about getting more than 1 Gbps to each AP for a long time.

Also most of 802.11ac APs are fine with 802.3af!

 

 

Philippe Hanset

 

I would say take a close look at the 100M ports connected to your N or AC APs and check for output drops.  We've seen this in some locations where we we're careful about refreshing with N AP's.  It likely comes at peak times so if you're just graphing the in/out you will miss it.

Don Wright
Brown University



What is it you think is happening during output drops? -- Daniel Eklund Network Planning Manager ITS Communications Systems and Data Centers University of Michigan 734.763.6389
The packets being dropped on the way back to the AP because they're overrunning the 100M interface during peak wireless usage.   You'll also notice if you do a speedtest that the download is much worse than the upload.  We seen this disappear when we swap in a gig switch. 
- Don


There is also the option, if you're a vendor that owns both ends (AP and Switch) to do something creative with only a single Cat5/6.
 
Jeff

>>> On Wednesday, December 18, 2013 at 9:51 AM, in message <47FE4CC0B92ADA478ECC286A11E9730150AE6E@SUEX10-mbx-03.ad.syr.edu>, Peter P Morrissey <ppmorris@SYR.EDU> wrote:

We’ve decided for now to run two Cat6A to every AP for new construction. This is because right now it is not clear if vendors are going to utilize two Gig or one 10 Gig connection for each AP to support the theoretical oversubscription of one Gig by Wave2 and beyond. One of the challenges is that cabling lifecycle is 15-20 years easily which means that there will be multiple generations of wireless running on that cable beyond even wave2. For insurance in the long term, it seems to make the most sense to invest in 6A.

 

We are finding that CAT6A is very expensive to install due to the higher costs for the cable and termination hardware as well as labor. In addition, the pathway requirements for the fatter cable are also much more expensive and also disruptive if it is renovation of existing construction. Not sure what CAT7 will buy you. I believe it is shielded and will mix more easily with Cat6, and is more narrow which addresses pathway concerns, but there is also the hassle of terminating on a good ground which complicates things quite a bit.

 

Pete Morrissey

 

Years ago I “got creative” and made some patch cables that allowed me to put two 10M hosts on a single jack instead of pulling new cables.  The boss said unkind things and shoved a notebook of the TIA-568 spec in my face.  Ah, the bad old days…;-)

John

 

That was a "standard" across the AMP jacks...  you could get one Cat5 100Mbps, or two 10Mb "split cable" jacks.  It was a matter of which "insert" you plugged into the socket.

It wasn't my decision, and I cringe everytime I see one, but they're still around in our older campus buildings.

Jeff

On 12/18/2013 4:42 PM, John York wrote:

Years ago I “got creative” and made some patch cables that allowed me to put two 10M hosts on a single jack instead of pulling new cables.  The boss said unkind things and shoved a notebook of the TIA-568 spec in my face.  Ah, the bad old days…;-)

John

 

We had thousands of those, wired for usoc on the wallplate side, a splitter to send 2 pairs to two station cables with usoc on one and 568b on the station end. We had this for our entire cat-3 plant, and some of the early cat-5 (non-e) terminated on 110 blocks. I don't miss that any more than I miss faculty putting 10base2 on rg-59. Dale Thus spake John York (YorkJ@BRCC.EDU) on Wed, Dec 18, 2013 at 09:42:27PM +0000: > Years ago I “got creative” and made some patch cables that allowed me to put two 10M hosts on a single jack instead of pulling new cables. The boss said unkind things and shoved a notebook of the TIA-568 spec in my face. Ah, the bad old days…;-) > John > >
+1

This has been the case for us for years. 95%+ of our traffic is not local.

           
Rand
 
Rand P. Hall
Director, Network Services                 askIT!
Merrimack College
978-837-3532

If I had an hour to save the world, I would spend 59 minutes defining the problem and one minute finding solutions. – Einstein


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