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For those of you following the development of gigabit Wi-Fi:

 

http://www.networkworld.com/news/2012/010912-ces-gigabit-wifi-254659.html?hpg1=bn

 

Thanks,

 

Hector Rios

Louisiana State University

********** Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/.

Comments

Message from cl.pronk@avans.nl

Anyone would like to comment on the use of wide channels in 5Ghz, especially with this (old but imho still useful info) in mind? See: http://www.ti.com/lit/wp/sply003/sply003.pdf Also for environments having to deal with DFS i foresee challenges......any comments? Thanks and have a great new wifi year! Kees Pronk >>> Hector J Rios 1/10/2012 3:36 >>> For those of you following the development of gigabit Wi-Fi: http://www.networkworld.com/news/2012/010912-ces-gigabit-wifi-254659.htm... Thanks, Hector Rios Louisiana State University ********** Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/. --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Op deze e-mail zijn de volgende voorwaarden van toepassing: The following conditions apply to this e-mail: http://emaildisclaimer.avans.nl --------------------------------------------------------------------------- ********** Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/.
I think the usage of wide channels requires a thoughtful look at the needs of the users in the environment. If the users need the higher bandwidth and/or you can space the channel coverage out so as to not cause co-channel interference then their shouldn't be an issue. If bandwidth isn't a concern and/or the environment has a lot of overlap then wider channels may not be needed. I can't really comment on the DFS as I'm not sure how 802.11n handles it.

My question is, are these high speeds really necessary? I don't watch very closely, but I've never seen a wired user consume a high percentage bandwidth. I'm looking at pushing for some wireless upgrades in the coming years, but I myself can't really see a good reason to wait for the new HT technologies.

--
Heath Barnhart, CCNA
Network Administrator
Information Systems Services
Washburn University
Topeka, KS

On 1/10/2012 9:53 AM, Kees Pronk wrote:
Anyone would like to comment on the use of wide channels in 5Ghz, especially with this (old but imho still useful info) in mind? See: http://www.ti.com/lit/wp/sply003/sply003.pdf Also for environments having to deal with DFS i foresee challenges......any comments? Thanks and have a great new wifi year! Kees Pronk
Hector J Rios <hrios@LSU.EDU> 1/10/2012 3:36 >>>
For those of you following the development of gigabit Wi-Fi: http://www.networkworld.com/news/2012/010912-ces-gigabit-wifi-254659.html?hpg1=bn Thanks, Hector Rios Louisiana State University ********** Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/. --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Op deze e-mail zijn de volgende voorwaarden van toepassing: The following conditions apply to this e-mail: http://emaildisclaimer.avans.nl --------------------------------------------------------------------------- ********** Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/.



********** Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/.

Message from elacroix@newhampton.org

<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?>
I am not a wireless network engineer by any stretch of the imagination. However, I do love analogies... and to me, taking up two lanes on an existing highway to let one lane of traffic drive faster does seem somewhat shortsighted.

My second point is related to Heath's excellent question: "are these high speeds really necessary?" At least on my campus, the drive for wireless is to give users reliable access to the Internet. Since we will not have enough bandwidth in the foreseeable future to have 802.11n WiFi be the bottleneck, I am quietly wondering how necessary this kind of upgrade would be for us.

Eric
__________________________________________________________
Eric LaCroix, Director of Technology, New Hampton School
70 Main Street * New Hampton, NH 03256
603-677-3450 phone & fax


The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv              <WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU> writes:
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

--Boundary_(ID_dKTAId9Hqbr2otAyVMLbKw)
Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
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I think the usage of wide channels requires a thoughtful look at the
needs of the users in the environment. If the users need the higher
bandwidth and/or you can space the channel coverage out so as to not
cause co-channel interference then their shouldn't be an issue. If
bandwidth isn't a concern and/or the environment has a lot of overlap
then wider channels may not be needed. I can't really comment on the DFS
as I'm not sure how 802.11n handles it.

My question is, are these high speeds really necessary? I don't watch
very closely, but I've never seen a wired user consume a high percentage
bandwidth. I'm looking at pushing for some wireless upgrades in the
coming years, but I myself can't really see a good reason to wait for
the new HT technologies.

--
*Heath Barnhart, CCNA*
Network Administrator
Information Systems Services
Washburn University
Topeka, KS

On 1/10/2012 9:53 AM, Kees Pronk wrote:
> Anyone would like to comment on the use of wide channels in 5Ghz, especially with this (old but imho still useful info) in mind? See: http://www.ti.com/lit/wp/sply003/sply003.pdf
>
> Also for environments having to deal with DFS i foresee challenges......any comments?
>
> Thanks and have a great new wifi year!
>
> Kees Pronk
>
>
>
>
>>>> Hector J Rios<hrios@LSU.EDU>  1/10/2012 3:36>>>
> For those of you following the development of gigabit Wi-Fi:
>
>
> Thanks,
>
> Hector Rios
> Louisiana State University
>
> **********
> Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/.
>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Op deze e-mail zijn de volgende voorwaarden van toepassing:
> The following conditions apply to this e-mail:
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> **********
> Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/.




**********
Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/.


--Boundary_(ID_dKTAId9Hqbr2otAyVMLbKw)
Content-type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT

<html>
 <head>
   <meta content="text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1"
     http-equiv="Content-Type">
 </head>
 <body bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000">
   I think the usage of wide channels requires a thoughtful look at the
   needs of the users in the environment. If the users need the higher
   bandwidth and/or you can space the channel coverage out so as to not
   cause co-channel interference then their shouldn't be an issue. If
   bandwidth isn't a concern and/or the environment has a lot of
   overlap then wider channels may not be needed. I can't really
   comment on the DFS as I'm not sure how 802.11n handles it.<br>
   <br>
   My question is, are these high speeds really necessary? I don't
   watch very closely, but I've never seen a wired user consume a high
   percentage bandwidth. I'm looking at pushing for some wireless
   upgrades in the coming years, but I myself can't really see a good
   reason to wait for the new HT technologies.<br>
   <br>
   -- <br>
   <b>Heath Barnhart, CCNA</b><br>
   Network Administrator<br>
   Information Systems Services<br>
   Washburn University<br>
   Topeka, KS<br>
   <br>
   On 1/10/2012 9:53 AM, Kees Pronk wrote:
   <blockquote cite="mid:4F0C6D16020000840001B615@gwiahsl1.avans.nl"
     type="cite">
     <pre wrap="">Anyone would like to comment on the use of wide channels in 5Ghz, especially with this (old but imho still useful info) in mind? See: <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.ti.com/lit/wp/sply003/sply003.pdf">http://www.ti.com/lit/wp/sply003/sply003.pdf</a>

Also for environments having to deal with DFS i foresee challenges......any comments?

Thanks and have a great new wifi year!

Kees Pronk




</pre>
     <blockquote type="cite">
       <blockquote type="cite">
         <blockquote type="cite">
           <pre wrap="">Hector J Rios <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:hrios@LSU.EDU">&lt;hrios@LSU.EDU&gt;</a> 1/10/2012 3:36  &gt;&gt;&gt;
</pre>
         </blockquote>
       </blockquote>
     </blockquote>
     <pre wrap="">For those of you following the development of gigabit Wi-Fi:

<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.networkworld.com/news/2012/010912-ces-gigabit-wifi-254659.html?hpg1=bn">http://www.networkworld.com/news/2012/010912-ces-gigabit-wifi-254659.html?hpg1=bn</a>

Thanks,

Hector Rios
Louisiana State University

**********
Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group discussion list can be found at <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.educause.edu/groups/">http://www.educause.edu/groups/</a>.


---------------------------------------------------------------------------
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<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://emaildisclaimer.avans.nl">http://emaildisclaimer.avans.nl</a>
---------------------------------------------------------------------------

**********
Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group discussion list can be found at <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.educause.edu/groups/">http://www.educause.edu/groups/</a>.
</pre>
   </blockquote>
   <br>
   <br>
   <div class="moz-signature"><br>
   </div>
 </body>
</html>
**********
Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/.
<p>

--Boundary_(ID_dKTAId9Hqbr2otAyVMLbKw)--


********** Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/.

Message from reb@ncsu.edu

While the high speeds may not be necessary, "perception is reality." They will be demanded because the capability is there!  IMHO in the 5GHz world there are enough channels to handle bonding them!  And...if you make the bandwidth available somebody will use it!

Sent from my iPhone

And someone also said we would never need more than 32 bits of addressing. :P

23 - 20 MHz Channels
        or
11 - 40 MHz Channels
        or
5 - 80 MHz Channels and two 20 MHz

160 MHz channels only allow for two bonded channels and 6 left over 20 MHz. Unless I'm missing something here, that space looks smaller and smaller.

I don't disagree with the perception piece though. The thing is I've never had a user on my network ever perceive the wireless network as being fast. Yeah, I could through around the buzz words and hype at people who don't really understand the technology to get my way, but I would be doing a huge disservice to them, especially after nothing changes because even though the infrastructure can support the new bling the clients can't (and probably never will).



On 1/10/2012 2:00 PM, Rick Brown wrote:
While the high speeds may not be necessary, "perception is reality." They will be demanded because the capability is there!  IMHO in the 5GHz world there are enough channels to handle bonding them!  And...if you make the bandwidth available somebody will use it!

Sent from my iPhone

Just as important as the high throughput is the better quality cells, the ability of MIMO to handle multipath, band steering and other features that make for a better radio cell with 11n. Wide channels in 5 GHz for 11n are a safe bet- there is usually enough channels to burn 40 MHz without penalty. But 80 MHz and 160 MHz for 11ac 500 Mbps and Gig speeds? Sounds more consumer-oriented than enterprisey right now to me.

 

 

 

Lee H. Badman

Wireless/Network Engineer

Information Technology and Services

Adjunct Instructor, iSchool

Syracuse University

315 443-3003

 

 

From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv [mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Rick Brown
Sent: Tuesday, January 10, 2012 3:01 PM
To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Betr.: [WIRELESS-LAN] Gigabit Wi-Fi

 

While the high speeds may not be necessary, "perception is reality." They will be demanded because the capability is there!  IMHO in the 5GHz world there are enough channels to handle bonding them!  And...if you make the bandwidth available somebody will use it!

Sent from my iPhone


You got it right Lee. The higher speeds will not necessarily be of use for us in the higher ed sector (yet... you never know), although it will be nice to simply have the capability in those special cases where they could be used. For now the one advantage that Gigabit Wi-Fi will provide will be improved HD video streaming. Again, you could see this mainly as a consumer-oriented advantage rather than an enterprise. But we are seeing more and more devices with wireless network capabilities these days. I think these new standards will be the answer to the growth of all these upcoming WiFi-enabled devices.

 

Hector Rios

Louisiana State University

Message from me@mpking.com

I can't find the direct quote.  I can find the mission statement that is directly related to it:

But a project manager invovled with the Google Fiber Project (Gigabit access to the home in Kansas City) had a quote along the lines of:

When everyone had a modem, and only accessed email and basic webpages, nobody could imagine downloading a movie, and video conferencing (Skyping).  Now this is commonplace.  We don't know what people will do with larger bandwidth, because it's never been available.

I think of this quote every time someone start talking about connection speeds (Be it Wireless, Wired, and Consumer Connections)

Mike

Message from zjennings@wcupa.edu

With the amount of glasses free HD 3D screens being shown at CES this week, I would imagine something along the lines of Skype in HD 3D. Also, the next HD standard will be 4k HD. That will exceed the limits of current 802.11n. Think of it this way, HDMI version 1.4 cables are capable of 10Gbps. People are going to want that without the wires (eventually). Can you imagine the day when all you have to do is hang that new TV on your wall and plug in the power? I can. And it will be amazing. Of course then there’s wireless power. So maybe not even a power cable. J

 

Zach Jennings

Senior Network Server Manager

Aruba Certified Mobility Professional, Airheads MVP

West Chester University of PA

610-436-1069

 

From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv [mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Mike King
Sent: Wednesday, January 11, 2012 10:37 AM
To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Betr.: [WIRELESS-LAN] Gigabit Wi-Fi

 

I can't find the direct quote.  I can find the mission statement that is directly related to it:

 

But a project manager invovled with the Google Fiber Project (Gigabit access to the home in Kansas City) had a quote along the lines of:

 

When everyone had a modem, and only accessed email and basic webpages, nobody could imagine downloading a movie, and video conferencing (Skyping).  Now this is commonplace.  We don't know what people will do with larger bandwidth, because it's never been available.

 

I think of this quote every time someone start talking about connection speeds (Be it Wireless, Wired, and Consumer Connections)

Mike

 

Message from safranj@greenmtn.edu

To add to Zach's point about not plugging in, the one thing no one is mentioning is the ability to do backhaul over the air.  Yes, running a wire is always ideal, but imagine being able to roll out a full wireless deployment without pulling wires for network traffic.  Yes, you can do that now, but not at speeds that are close to wire speeds.  Of course, you will still need power... but you have to start somewhere.

-Jesse

Message from zjennings@wcupa.edu

Good call Jesse! It would also create a viable alternative to running fiber between buildings on campus, or provide a high-speed backup in case fiber goes down.

 

Zach Jennings

Senior Network Server Manager

Aruba Certified Mobility Professional, Airheads MVP

West Chester University of PA

610-436-1069

 

From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv [mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Jesse Safran
Sent: Wednesday, January 11, 2012 1:40 PM
To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Betr.: [WIRELESS-LAN] Gigabit Wi-Fi

 

To add to Zach's point about not plugging in, the one thing no one is mentioning is the ability to do backhaul over the air.  Yes, running a wire is always ideal, but imagine being able to roll out a full wireless deployment without pulling wires for network traffic.  Yes, you can do that now, but not at speeds that are close to wire speeds.  Of course, you will still need power... but you have to start somewhere.

-Jesse

An auditorium with an 8-antenna 802.11ac AP running a 160Mhz channel, with nearly 7Gbps aggregate bandwidth, sounds pretty interesting to me.
 
We have faculty that have students downloading a lot of information during class, so even in smaller 12-25 person classrooms, the added bandwidth means less time it getting the information, and more time spent teaching.
 
I also suspect that Apple will adopt the new standard in their laptops and desktops, so there is the chance you'll see 802.11ac capable devices within the next 12 months, and given that Apple's student share here at my campus is now ~75%, that translates into a lot of 802.11ac capable devices.
 
Jeff

>>> On Tuesday, January 10, 2012 at 12:35 PM, in message <943DA0E70434CA499AD0088FB90EAADE0E58F5@SUEX10-mbx-05.ad.syr.edu>, Lee H Badman <lhbadman@SYR.EDU> wrote:

Just as important as the high throughput is the better quality cells, the ability of MIMO to handle multipath, band steering and other features that make for a better radio cell with 11n. Wide channels in 5 GHz for 11n are a safe bet- there is usually enough channels to burn 40 MHz without penalty. But 80 MHz and 160 MHz for 11ac 500 Mbps and Gig speeds? Sounds more consumer-oriented than enterprisey right now to me.

 

 

 

Lee H. Badman

Wireless/Network Engineer

Information Technology and Services

Adjunct Instructor, iSchool

Syracuse University

315 443-3003

 

 

From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv [mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Rick Brown
Sent: Tuesday, January 10, 2012 3:01 PM
To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Betr.: [WIRELESS-LAN] Gigabit Wi-Fi

 

While the high speeds may not be necessary, "perception is reality." They will be demanded because the capability is there!  IMHO in the 5GHz world there are enough channels to handle bonding them!  And...if you make the bandwidth available somebody will use it!

Sent from my iPhone


Message from avoelker@email.wcu.edu

The consumer market loves new technology, and since this standardizes on the 5GHz band only, it is my best friend.  Most of the RF problems we have is because too many computers are perfectly happy working on N on the 2.4 GHz range, yet there are too many legacy devices and mobile devices to cut off that band.  The freedom of having so many NON-OVERLAPPING channels to play with is GREAT!  Having the high bandwidth overhead is wonderful, especially since wireless technology has a high loss overhead.  Remember how many packets get transmitted that aren’t actually payload. 

 

However they are increasing the amount of bandwidth by reducing the number of channels.  This really screws enterprises, apartment complexes, and, well, anywhere with a high concentration of access points.  Again, this is not the technology of the future.  This will take us one step closer, but ultimately the channels and airwaves will saturate again before the next decade and we will be back to the drawing board again.  We need more channels AND more bandwidth, not one or the other for it to be truly future-ready.

 

-- Andy Voelker

Manager of Student Computing in the Technology Commons

Western Carolina University

Be sure to check out the WCU TechTips Podcast at http://www.youtube.com/WesternCarolinaU!!

Check the status of your IT requests at any time at http://help.wcu.edu/ !

 

From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv [mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Jeffrey Sessler
Sent: Wednesday, January 11, 2012 3:04 PM
To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Betr.: [WIRELESS-LAN] Gigabit Wi-Fi

 

An auditorium with an 8-antenna 802.11ac AP running a 160Mhz channel, with nearly 7Gbps aggregate bandwidth, sounds pretty interesting to me.

 

We have faculty that have students downloading a lot of information during class, so even in smaller 12-25 person classrooms, the added bandwidth means less time it getting the information, and more time spent teaching.

 

I also suspect that Apple will adopt the new standard in their laptops and desktops, so there is the chance you'll see 802.11ac capable devices within the next 12 months, and given that Apple's student share here at my campus is now ~75%, that translates into a lot of 802.11ac capable devices.

 

Jeff

>>> On Tuesday, January 10, 2012 at 12:35 PM, in message <943DA0E70434CA499AD0088FB90EAADE0E58F5@SUEX10-mbx-05.ad.syr.edu>, Lee H Badman <lhbadman@SYR.EDU> wrote:

Just as important as the high throughput is the better quality cells, the ability of MIMO to handle multipath, band steering and other features that make for a better radio cell with 11n. Wide channels in 5 GHz for 11n are a safe bet- there is usually enough channels to burn 40 MHz without penalty. But 80 MHz and 160 MHz for 11ac 500 Mbps and Gig speeds? Sounds more consumer-oriented than enterprisey right now to me.

 

 

 

Lee H. Badman

Wireless/Network Engineer

Information Technology and Services

Adjunct Instructor, iSchool

Syracuse University

315 443-3003

 

 

From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv [mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Rick Brown
Sent: Tuesday, January 10, 2012 3:01 PM
To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Betr.: [WIRELESS-LAN] Gigabit Wi-Fi

 

While the high speeds may not be necessary, "perception is reality." They will be demanded because the capability is there!  IMHO in the 5GHz world there are enough channels to handle bonding them!  And...if you make the bandwidth available somebody will use it!

Sent from my iPhone


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